1. FrankG
    Looks interesting... I would also like to see the whole thing -- notwithstanding the ham acting from these two presenters. Thanks for sharing :-)

    But Gary Taubes? Oh noes! Isn't he the one that the naysayers keep telling us has been "debunked" by the shrieking harpy Evil-Lyn AKA Carb Insane?

    Why would these folks interview him alongside all these eminent MDs PhDs etc...? Are they crazy? Surely they ought to interview Evil-Lyn, or at least provide quotes from one of her published books?? Oh wait...

  2. Paul
    Could you clarify the comments of Prof. Tim Noakes for me Ondrej, please? - For the love of god I do not follow his logic. (or should I consult Anthony Colopo - or such-like)
    Reply: #3
  3. FrankG
    1:09 - 1:27 "If you're going to look back to the lead up to the 1977 dietary guideline which gave us the food pyramid, there was not one clinical trail... and the scientists at the time said we haven't had these trials; how can we expose the American public to this giant experiment"

    1:38 - 1:45 "Everyone was told that they needed to start eating more carbohydrates and you see athletes are doing it so it must be good for you"

    2:10 - 2:20 "What we did when we took the fat out of the diet and we went low-fats, we put sugar in its place; because as soon as you take fat out of the diet the food tastes so terrible"

    2:35 - 2:47 "Current dietary advice is that you must reduce your calories but you can continue to eat all the same food which means you've got the addictive foods in there... which is exactly the same as saying you must cut your cigarettes to one cigarette a day"

    I don't think I missed any but bearing in mind that this is a trailer and necessarily brief (as opposed to verbose and detailed) I think he was quite eloquent -- for someone who is considered a World authority on training endurance athletes. :-)

    Reply: #5
  4. Murray
    I much admire Tim Noakes's analytic acumen. I read his Waterlogged book and his interpretation of data and experiments is excellent, first rate. That said, his writing is terrible. It was an effort not to get bogged as I slogged through Waterlogged. I watched his TED talk, which was much less rambling (due to the 15 minute limit) than his book but disjoint and he literally flashed through some of his slides. From my experience, he is not a great communicator.

    Taubes, by contrast, is an excellent communicator. He works hard to put things simply, to lay out historical context, to find an apt turn of phrase or to write from an ironic rhetorical stance. Taubes lacks the expert's acumen of an original researcher, but he consults extensively with leading scientists, so one might disagree with him, but one is also disagreeing with a set of leading scientists in the process (recognizing that there is disagreement among leading scientists).

  5. Paul
    but wasn't prof. Noakes debunked by Evelyn Crabsane and Anthony Colopo?, I think he was.
    (I am not attacking you personally Ondrej - I am opposing the way you think, which in this public debate pertaining to diet/health, may in my understanding bring discomfort or harm to some)
    Reply: #7
  6. Murray
    Well, Dr. Noakes was "de-bunked" for over 20 years (mostly by scientists with direct and indirect links to sports drink manufacturers with considerable influence over guideline setting bodies, including dieticians) over the need for hydration during marathons and other physically challenging events. As someone who came to the issue agnostic either way, I would say subsequent research has vindicated his interpretation of the data. More importantly, the marathons that follow his protocol have no deaths from exercise associated hyponatremia, whereas the races that follow the protocols of those who "de-bunked" him still have EAH deaths.

    Regarding LCHF, Dr. Noakes has run a lot, over 70 marathons and ultra marathons. The fact is that all that continual exercise was insufficient to keep a high-carb diet from causing gradual weight gain and development metabolic syndrome. Going LCHF reversed that, with no increase in exercise. That is factual data. How has that been de-bunked? His twin daughters, conveniently, allowed him to design a diet protocol to test LCHF versus low fat, and LCHF prevailed. He and athletes training LCHF improved their performance over higher carb diets. How has that Been debunked? Did they have faulty time clocks?

    It really does not same much to say Dr. Noakes has been debunked without providing details. Otherwise it is a bare ad hominen attack of questionable motive.

  7. Matt
    Trouble with "debunking" is that everyone trots out their own preferred "experts" touting whatever major study happens to support their views... when it comes to nutritional studies, there are so many uncontrolled (and uncontrollable) variables to consider that it is next to impossible to reach a conclusion that is beyond doubt; and that's before you even consider that there is still a lot we don't even realise we don't know - unknown unknowns such as detailed knowledge of the effect of intestinal bacteria, which is now looking to be of primary importance.

    What we do know though is that almost everyone who has a degree of trouble controlling their weight and who has tried an atkins-type low-carb/high-fat diet has, once they have overcome the cravings, found an effortless solution that has resulted in normalised weight and in most cases a massive improvement in overall health.

    Reply: #8
  8. Paul
    Sorry guys - I intended that comment as a joke, in relation to some posts in this blog (e.g debunking G. Taubes et cetera). I apologize. I am a follower of prof. Noakes work.
  9. George P
    Damn, something's wrong with me. I'm following Diet Doctor daily but I've just made myself a carb bomb including ice cream, biscuits, melon and some coca-cola. I know it is bad for me but it tastes so fucking gooood. I'm probably one of the few people eating lard from a jar and shit like this pretty often :) At least I've trained pretty hard for a couple hours so let's hope the bad effects will be a bit lessened.

    And this begs something like a philosophical question. Do you prefer healthy foods that don't taste that good or some crappy foods that taste great. Do you prefer healthy but a bit boring life or not so healthy life in which you get to do some crazy ass shit?

    I mean, a lot of people eat all the shit in this world and most of them make it to 60 years without many major health problems. On the other hand you can eat all the proper food and something bad can still happen to you.

    Do you think people on LCHF are boring?

    Replies: #10, #11, #12
  10. FrankG
    Funny 'cos for supper tonight I cooked up a nice juicy steak, with English bacon and a couple of eggs... washed down with a single malt whisky, some mature cheese and dark chocolate.

    Boring? I don't think so :-)

    You need to check out Dr Eenfeldt's LCHF for Beginners section... no need for this way of eating to be bland and boring at all.

    I lead a busy and active life... getting my "exercise" by hiking the woods and wetlands in search of wildlife photographs, rather than mindlessly working the treadmill... boring? Are you serious?

    Reply: #14
  11. robert
    I ONLY eat food that tasted good. There's no point in eating something that tastes like 'cardboard' or turns your taste-buds / stomach into your worst enemy.

    However I usually don't eat food anymore that is irresistible / moreish, no matter how much I've already stuffed into my mouth. Interestingly (or not) this includes most of the processed foods out there - definitely pasta / pizza / ice-cream.

    I must admit that I do have a cheat-day once in a while. To make sure I don't end up with a carb-fest, I only buy a small amount of the cheater-foods. So even if I should devour all of them, no real harm done.

    The key point is not to have a stash of addictive foods in the pantry.

  12. Paul
    LCHF kitchen is as diverse and tasty/"exciting" as any other - it is all up to your imagination. If I had a chance to make you mine lamb/lard stew with my secret herbs and spices you would never make yourself car-bomb ice-cream again.

    do you think that any group of people with common interests or profession or certain hight or hair color or place of origin or what have you are boring ?.

  13. Ondrej
    It's not your fault that you are fat. It's the evil corporations that compel you to overeat.

    I've seen fast food employees cast a net on passersby, drag them into the restaurant and force feed them hamburgers and fries.

    I've seen carb/processed food at the grocery store have an svengali effect on shoppers, forcing them to buy it.

    I've seen them eating it like carb zombies.

    It's not their fault.

    Never mind the Japanese, who eat low fat/high carb and have the lowest BMI in the industrial world.

    It's the Japanese paradox!

    Reply: #17
  14. Ondrej
    "washed down with a single malt whisky"

    Do you have a substance abuse problem?

    Reply: #15
  15. FrankG
    Ondrej you seem to have a far greater than normal capacity for denying reality, and for going off like a wayward firecracker when someone presents views that contradict your cherished dogma.

    Your penchant for performing all manner of mental contortionism in order to rationalize scientifically untenable beliefs would garner envy from even the most fanatical Creationist.

    I think you need to start eating more saturated animal fat.

    Reply: #16
  16. Ondrej
    That's good frankie. There is still hope for you.
  17. robert
    I'm bold enough to hazard that traditional Japanese food (whatever it may be) is - on average - better than the SAD. There's fatty fish, fatty beef, eggs, lots of veg, seaweed and some noodles and some rice.

    I'm even bolder: I guess that anything you prepare yourself from fresh, natural and "real-food" ingredients that weren't massively subjected to industrialized processing is - on average - better than living on breakfast cereal, orange juice, low-fat fructose-infused yoghurt and ready-meals.

    If you haven't already crossed the line an become carb-intolerant, then "Just eat real food." - as Dr. Lustig likes to phrase it, should work. Personally I'd add "seasonal" to it.

    And "real food" doesn't include a whole lot of stuff that is currently sold in supermarkets.

    Michael Pollan phrased it like this: "Don't buy anything your great-grandmother wouldn't instantly recognize as food." So no fruit-yoghurts, no boxed juice, no energy-drinks, no fat-free lactose free milk, no margerine, no "I can't believe it's not butter" non-stick-sprays, no canola-oil and other machine-lubricants... it's pretty obvious I think.

    Reply: #18
  18. Ondrej
    You got that right!
  19. Ondrej
    Are you on your second bottle of single malt whisky? Enjoy it!
  20. Galina L.
    For somebody who became carb-intolerant, many of "real" foods contain too much carbs. I have been eating traditional Russian self-cooked food all my life, but after I turned 45, LC diet became necessary to keep me healthy. My self-cooked food kept my family members lean and healthy, for me it was not enough. Even in societies with good eating traditions you have no trouble to find people who suffer from modern deceases of Western civilization, people may look much thinner than Americans, but it doesn't mean their food can't stand improving.
  21. Murray
    I have found my taste has adapted. It's like music; a new genre sounds odd at first but it grows on you until it is woven into your inner fabric. I don't even like processed foods anymore. When my wife says I have to try a taste of a dessert because it is to die for (literally), it is invariably cloyingly sweet for me. I'd rather chew on a nice chunk of fresh rhubarb, which is in season just now. Once my taste adjusted to real foods, I could taste the difference between growing methods. I started noticing abig difference in different celeries and romaine lettuces as well. A whole new world.

    A "cheat" day for me is when I finish off all the leftover béarnaise sauce for dessert. Béarnaise sauce is sooo good.

  22. Sarah
    I'd love to have a big hot fudge sundae covered in whipped cream but I know it's going to make me feel like crap... so why bother?

    Most of the things I've craved in the past are tied more to fat than to sugar. Bread and butter for instance... it's the butter I really love, not so much the bread.

  23. Paul
    Did you know that Einstein frequently fasted? - some say to boost his ketones.


  24. ZellZ
    This looks to be an interesting movie. The problem, as I see it, with a lchf diet is that a great many people are not interested in doing a diet so "extreme". And, really, it IS an extreme diet in many ways. No breads, not even complex grained ones. No beans. Limited fruit. But plenty of fat, yes Lots & Lots of fat. Well, not everyone wants to eat this way. Many people are willing to admit that simple carbs & sugary treats are bad to eat in great amounts, but they still want to have their whole grain cereal w/milk, their whole grain tortillas w/beans, their plentiful amounts of fruit for snacks & desserts. Lchf is Not for everyone & not Everyone can lose all the weight they need to, on it. In fact, any & every diet or eating plan seems to have a built-in "expire by" date, at which time the tedium of eating a given way & the frustrating lack of further weight loss kicks in to derail even the most dedicated dieters. I think the "sugar is addictive" take is very important, though, and many people can embrace this concept, eat less of the stuff & still eat mainly as they have already been eating: low fat & whole grains. I think high fat Only works when one reduces carbs to ketogenic levels - which is Very Extreme, Indeed (compared to a normal way of eating) - and not a way of eating that many will embrace, (outside of low carb aficionados) especially not in the long term.
    Reply: #25
  25. Paul
    So be it. No one is forcing anyone to change his/her way of life. This blog is only a proposition of a particular life-style, one out of many, which personally I find very satisfying on all fronts. If you enjoy your cornflakes for breakfast or tortilla with beans for lunch - why not, enjoy it. However there are some of us who wish to lead healthy/ vigorous/active/medication free life - and as far as I am concerned dietary carbohydrates are one of the major obstacles to such life-style.
  26. bill

    That's funny that you outed Anthony Colpo...
    I mean Ondrej, with that quote taken
    verbatim from his website. Good work.

    But he still doesn't give up.

    I actually laughed out loud. Funny!

  27. Van Dammage
    firstly, fund your own DOC. stop beggin for money from low carbers. and no, you dont need all kinds of silly kiddy graphics, or super lightweight upbeat music only 5 year olds find enjoying. focus on the facts. and i dont want to hear your high pitched girly voices throughout the whole thing, or im not gonna watch it.
    sorry, but it had to be said.
  28. Kimchi
    Why do Americans keep saying "de-bunking"?

    It doesn't mean anything.

    Reply: #29
  29. Paul
    debunk |diˈbəNGk|
    verb [ with obj. ]
    expose the falseness or hollowness of (a myth, idea, or belief): the magazine that debunks claims of the paranormal.
    • reduce the inflated reputation of (someone), esp. by ridicule: comedy takes delight in debunking heroes.
    debunker noun,
    debunkery noun

    do you have a dictionary Kimchi ?

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